Alec Goldman (00:00.110)
Welcome to How I Grew My Practice, a 15 minute podcast sponsored by NexHealth. My name's Alec joined today by the Brad Newman founder for sure. Uh, but I think more importantly, chief buzz officer of the marketing agency, Dentainment. He's here to talk a lot about how to turn website visitors into new patients. Brad. It is so dang good to see you. How are you doing?Brad (00:01.820)
Thanks for watching!
I'm doing great, buddy. I feel like I wanted to be in the kitchen for this recording so we could cook up some great marketing ideas together.
Alec Goldman (00:36.166)
I would expect no less. Brad, if you don't mind, just for the folks who don't know you, if you can, just give us a little bit of background how you kind of got into this crazy industry.
Yeah, so besides my incredible culinary skills, I'm kidding, I can make a nice carbonara though. You know, I started, it's interesting. I started my first dot com in 98. I went to college in Ohio and I started an online portal. It was like an early version, I know this sounds crazy, of social media back then. Anyway, I've always been obsessed with the internet.
in digital products and online advertising. And so a little over 10 years ago, my dentist at the time, Dr. Lindy Beverly, who I love, dentist in Santa Monica, I asked Dr. Beverly if I could do her marketing. She said yes, and the rest is history. I've been solely focused on dentistry for over 10 years and absolutely love it. And Dentainment is the agency.
Alec Goldman (01:36.362)
That's so cool and such a bizarre way to get into the industry. But I guess it's how we all fall into it.
I know, it's really great and I credit their amazing front desk manager at the time, Manny, such a nice guy and he really got it done for me. Like he was root for me and at the time I was doing digital marketing for like random different types of...
industries, different verticals, a yoga company, a museum security company, like not really focused on one niche. And Dr. Beverly invited me down to the Anaheim CDA conference and fell in love with it. And it's been great since. And our big thing though is really, which we'll get into is really focusing on like a customized unique approach for each practice because, you know, 10 years ago that was needed today.
everything needs to be so manicured for each specific practice to make sure you're getting that conversion rate optimization and healthy new patient flow.
Alec Goldman (02:35.394)
Yeah, I mean, let's, if you don't mind, let's jump right into it. We're here really just talking about how to optimize your website and get visitors to turn into patients. I mean, top of mind, that topic, what are your thoughts?
So the first thing I would do is focus on the above the fold section of a website. So the top section of a website, both desktop and mobile, I like it's making or breaking conversion on dental websites. So first off, you wanna obsess about that top section before anyone scrolls down. So I say above the fold, it's the header section. Which images are you using? So the last thing you wanna do is have eyelines on the header images where the people are looking towards website visitors.
So if you land on a dental website and you got some boring stock image or even the dental team all looking at the website visitor, that will result in higher bounce rates because most people don't wanna be looked at even though it's a virtual experience, right? So for instance, if you walked into a restaurant and you had dinner tonight at eight o'clock and everyone stopped eating and looked up at you while you walked in, it'd be a little weird. I know it's a virtual experience, but the same thing. So in turn, you wanna do direct.
the eyelines of people in those images towards your desired call to action button. So for instance, let's say I'm the doctor, I'm on this side of frame, my patient's in the operatory right here, the patient and I are looking at each other, so eyelines looking at each other, you would then place the call to action button right here, right here, between our eyelines, so you would then be drawn to the call to action button. So instead of eyeline to the camera, directed towards your desired call to action. And the call to action
If you're using NexHealth, which obviously you should be, it could be something like book online now, or request my appointment, or reserve my experience. Whatever that call to action you have is very important. Make sure it's worded and the framing of the visitor reading it. I like book my appointment, right? Not book appointment or book your appointment, book my appointment, because you'll have a higher conversion rate as well. So last thing on that, above the fold, eyelines, the right call to action, and then also,
not just one image, you don't want to bet the whole farm on one image, rotating images, right? Most of you have WordPress websites, so maybe five, six, seven images rotating. First you have a great picture of the, maybe the dentist and a patient. Then maybe you could go into a premium stock image of maybe your target demographic. Then you go back into custom. Perhaps you want to have a header video for seven or eight seconds that rotates. Whatever it is, you want that content at the top to be highly...
customized, unique, and focused on conversion rate optimization.
Alec Goldman (05:17.870)
A lot of emphasis on above the fold, which we do the same at NexHealth in regards to ours. Outside of just above the fold, so we've, as you just mentioned, types of images, CTA, playing with the words on the CTA. If we start making our way down the web page, what are the other elements that we would want to add to optimize our home page?
Yeah, great question. So directly under your top header section, you want trust signals. So trust signals are the association logos that you're members of, right? So if you're a member of AGD, AACD, ADA, your state and local dental associations, all of those logos are trust signals. If you're an Invisalign provider, if you went to COIS, if you went to SPARE, whatever it is, you wanna have those logos directly
under your header section. And for our client websites and dentainment, we usually recreate those logos and source those with the same, we redesign those with the same color palette as the dental practices logo. I just feel like it's a much better design element vibe. And so then you would have those trust signals slowly rotating across the screen for...
higher conversion rate optimization. Because if a lot of people may become your website and you're targeting cosmetic cases or implants, and they see that you're a member of the American Academy of Dental Implants, or AACD, whatever it may be, these are called trust signals, which would then increase your conversion rate optimization even more.
Alec Goldman (06:54.151)
Cool. So obviously trust can come from the corporations that you're a part of to say that I am somebody who's educated and trusted. Where do patient reviews make their way onto the website?
Great question. So social proof is a big part of a website and a homepage. But a lot of the time people have already read your reviews. That's why they're on your website. So even though they're really important, before I would get to that, the third element that would really have somewhere high up on that homepage is a harrow video, the homepage harrow video, right? Something two to three minutes long introducing new visitors to your dental practice.
talking about your passion for clinical excellence, the unique patient experiences. There, you can have a compilation of some great video testimonials. That's a 10X on social proof right there. But really that homepage video is so powerful. Statistics show that by having one video embedded on a homepage, it will increase your conversion rates by 80%, okay? Now Google owns YouTube, YouTube's the second largest search engine in the world, and video is also considered the heaviest form of multimedia content.
So just to recap so far, you got above the fold with the I-lines and directing towards the right call of action. Then we move into trust signals, which are the logos. And then we have the embedded code from YouTube for your homepage video, two to three minutes. Those three elements alone will without question, without question, improve your conversion rate optimization, regardless of your traffic or spend on advertising, stay the exact same. Okay.
Alec Goldman (08:31.766)
Very good. On the homepage, is there a fourth element after those three? Or do you recommend keeping it? Okay, continue, yeah, yeah.
And by the way, you can get creative. Besides the header and the trust thing, you could put things before the homepage. You could put services. If you have an incredible smile gallery, show that off. And by the way, smile galleries, yes, you should be using before and after pictures. And sets of four are much more powerful. So before and after is close up. Before and after, full face. Tell the story, much better. And plus, a lot of people know that.
You know, anyone could go to Shutterstock or Canva and just grab free stock image photos now. So you wanna make sure you're showing off your real beautiful smiles of your patients. Maybe put a little watermark in the corner, not because someone's gonna steal the image, which maybe you wanna do anyway. It's also because you want these people to know, no, these are our patients, like real patients. And so having that smile gallery, a little bit of it on the homepage and then directing people to your smile gallery is really powerful as well. If you're focused on cosmetics.
Real quick, if you don't mind me backing up for a second, Alec, because I just wanted to describe what conversion rate optimization is, and maybe I should have started with that. So CRO, otherwise known as conversion rate optimization, is the percentage of visitors to a website that actually become a patient, right? That's all we care about. So in any industry, whether it's a pizza place, a widget e-commerce, a hotel, a dental office, you know, a chiropractor.
Alec Goldman (09:38.698)
any industry, the average CRO is one to 3%. It seems very low, right? 3% being really high for most good marketing people, right? We feel like, why can't it be five, eight, 10 plus percent if you do the right things, right? So even if your traffic stays the same, if you only increased your CRO, that alone would be game changing for your new patient numbers.
and overall revenues without question. So start obsessing about your CRO. The percentage of people that come to your website and that actually book, because right now, instead of spending an extra dollar here or there, fixing the CRO is the immediate way to improve things by maybe 5% without spending another dollar. It's just changing out the images, trying different wording on a button, taking a video maybe you already have on YouTube and betting on the homepage, reorganizing things quickly might really make
Alec Goldman (11:06.762)
Very good. Can you talk to us a little bit? I know you just mentioned just like the channels at which folks are coming to the website. One, how are you recommending practices to understand their channels and optimizing a single homepage given the many channels that patients may be coming from?
Yeah, it's a great question. So every practice is different, although there's gonna be your reoccurring themes across practices, right? So I don't know of a practice or any, most local businesses, let's just say dental right now, I don't know of a practice in North America that should not be running Google AdWords. I'm not saying Google AdWords is perfect or you're gonna have the greatest ROI on every dollar, but it is really amazing if done properly.
Right? How great is it that you could spend, I don't know, five, six, seven bucks for a cost per click, potentially if your practice is trying to attract cosmetic dentistry in Madison, Wisconsin. Why wouldn't you want to pay for that intent-based search? It's a no-brainer. They're not charging you more because of the potential ROI in your practice, right? So Google AdWords, no-brainer. Optimizing for great ranking is important. Social media, yes, obviously important.
But some practices might rely on totally different forms of marketing to generate new traffic to their website, right? It could be strategic partnerships. It could be email newsletters. It could be inbound. It could be online streaming commercials. It could be, you know, digital advertising in a lot of different ways. I think moving forward, I'm very excited about Bing because of ChatGPT, the integrations with Bing.
Samsung now is going to be switching their default search browser to Bing from Google, it looks like. So there's a lot of things moving in search. Humans are creatures of habit. So this is not going to be overnight in terms of people jumping ship from Google. And obviously Google has Bard and DeepMind, and they're going to have a lot of great things in AI. But like Bing is going to be great. So positioning yourself there is going to be great. But here's the thing.
You know, there's a saying that like Google doesn't love you until everyone else loves you. You can't fake this, right? Like if you just opened up a few months ago, like you shouldn't expect to be like the first result, first page for any business. Unless you had some like crazy PR event and like something crazy is going on in the business, right? Really good. And so the best rankings happen through tapping into social proof of patience, providing amazing patient experiences, generating, you know, video content.
getting people to search for your business. There's like 200 plus factors for increasing your improving your SEO. But I would say for each practice, Alec, to answer your question more precisely, pick the top three channels that you feel are performing for you that you know, right? What are they? It might be LinkedIn, right? It might be Instagram advertising. It might be just referrals. I don't know, every practice is different. And then double down on those things. And then also focus on what we spoke about already, improving the CRO. Last thing I want to mention,
before we jump on to like some of your other questions is, I mentioned one, two, three sections, clearly some were on there and I'm not just saying this because we're on a call together right now. Like you have to have online scheduling right now. Like you really do. What statistics show that 40% of people book these appointments after hours. So it's a clear no brainer, just like any restaurant would need to have open table or resi, every practice needs to have online scheduling. Now you can still offer a phone call or a.
a chat or an email of course, but by offering online scheduling, you'll have obviously way greater success. So somewhere on that homepage, there should be an additional area, at least one or two other areas as they scroll down to book my appointment. You can link that out to their NexHealth URL. What we love to do for our clients that use NexHealth is actually embed that scheduling functionality within the website so it's on site. So having all these online scheduling done.
And the website will also keep people around for longer, increase the website session duration times, so maybe get people to stay for over two minutes plus. That alone is great for your search engine optimization. The longer people stay on the website. Anything you can do to keep people engaged and stay longer on your website, there is a direct correlation to a higher conversion rate optimization.
Alec Goldman (15:36.846)
Brad, you've been a part of tons of site reconstructions, building tons of dentist websites, tons of practice websites. What is the number one most creative thing that you have seen implemented into a site and thought, wow, like this is something that I really would recommend to tons of different practices out there?
Dude, that's a great question. It's so good, because we literally did not have like any pre-production. Before we started recording, we talked about a lot of fun stuff, but I didn't know this question was coming and I love it. Here's what I recommend, okay? So we talked about social proof. Clearly tapping into your existing patients to become ambassadors for your practice is good marketing. It's a win. Now.
Let's just go back to that practice who's maybe interested in cosmetic dentistry, smile makeovers, that type of service, right? Where if you've done some amazing cases over the years, which a lot of you have, and you have great before and after pictures, instead of compiling all those onto one page for testimonials, give each of these patients more love. Why not have a separate website page for each individual case you've done?
Right, so let's just take Amy, for instance. Amy had porcelain veneers done. You have four incredible before and after pictures. Great, let's create a dedicated standalone page for Amy around porcelain veneers, showing those before and after pictures, having some really nice copy, unique fresh copy around the porcelain veneers procedure, how it works if you're a candidate, maybe timelines and all these things. Perhaps a video testimonial of Amy.
Right? Information about porcelain veneers, descriptions about your office, and then you could then share that specific URL, maybe every few months for a testimonial Tuesday post. It would definitely give you much greater SEO juice. You'll have more fresh quality content on your website. And plus, people who are in, in the mood to currently be looking for like, smile makeover near me, or best cosmetic dentists in our city.
If you could do these things, you're already sitting on this content, but if you could present these in a little more manicured, organized, professional manner, no one else is doing it. And just another way to increase your conversion rate optimization, because you should be obsessing about every visitor that comes to your website and have them to either book online or to call or reach out into a virtual consult, whatever it is. Every call, every email, every lead at your practice is so
important. And so as you set these things up moving forward, you'll have a much greater CRO if you give way more love to what you're already sitting at and that is incredible social proof, before and after pictures, video content. These are multimedia pieces that you already have. You don't have to invest any more money. Just repurposing them in more unique ways will have huge implications in a good way moving forward.
Alec Goldman (18:46.986)
I love that with Amy, even to add to it a little bit, it would be very cool to understand from the consumer's perspective of why they perhaps did the procedure. Was it a special event in their life? So knowing the why and hearing the why, and then seeing how the doctor or the practice were able to enable that why to successfully happen, I think would go a long way.
Absolutely, absolutely. And then also the front desk or team can, if someone's reaching out about veneers, you could then share that public URL with that interested patient. You're coming in next Tuesday for a council on veneers. By the way, check out Amy's story, right? Hopefully you have a patient wall of fame at your practice with before and after pictures. And maybe if Amy's
cases up on the wall with the beautiful smile and before and afters, the porcelain veneers, perhaps put like a little QR code under that, boom, scan it, you go right to the Amy URL, you watch the video, you see the before and afters, and you really, you don't need hundreds of these, maybe five, six, whatever it is, really, really dedicated URLs for different types of services. One for Invisalign, one for smile makeovers, one for implants, whatever it is, so then you can really leverage that content for people who are on the fence.
Can you imagine someone sending you a link to a procedure that you're on the fence about? But like, no, no, this person had this case done and it's not like an advertisement or a manic or a script. This is a real patient and you have maybe have multiple ones of those. Clearly that would really impact the CRO.
Alec Goldman (20:23.454)
Yeah, that's a great idea. So there's lots of technology to optimize a web page that we've gone through and at least alluded to. Just for the viewers out there, what is a traditional tech stack when it comes to who's hosting the website, the content, the CMS, appointment scheduling?
Alec Goldman (20:47.614)
If there's anybody who's helping out with phone calls, like there's so much that goes into this to actually getting somebody into the seat. What are your general recommendations for practices to be successful?
tech stack? Great question, but it wasn't expected that as well. That's fantastic. That's great. So I'll just tell you how we do it with most offices. And I'm not implying like we have the best way or only way. There's a bunch of different ways out there. I'm sure other agencies have their own approach, which is super cool. So all of our websites that we create are done on WordPress platform. They still are. And we've beta tested with some other platforms, just the robust functionality, SEO capabilities, plugins, everything with WordPress is still
Alec Goldman (21:05.366)
Here we go.
incredibly awesome, and then beautiful, clean, modern, minimalistic design at WordPress. So that's why we love WordPress. We host everything on our own dedicated advanced server with WP Engine, which is a really fast, secure, high-performing hosting provider, right? Like GoDaddy's great for domain names. You don't wanna host with them. And so, yeah, so that's with that. In terms of online scheduling,
If any of our offices that have online scheduling, the office you use, NexHealth, we highly recommend offices have a phone answering service. And so we provide a recommendation for that. And because not answering the phone is insanity, you know, it's crazy. At the end of the day, we'll just mention that for a second. Like anyone who has a business that's open or practice that's open, statistics show that only one out of six phone calls at a dental office are answered.
and 35% of people that call and get an answer machine will never call back. So let's just take that office again in Madison, Wisconsin, I think the example was, that's going for cosmetic dentistry. How do you not answer that phone after hours? I just don't understand it. So, listen, some teams are super stealthy when they have it, some don't, and so I'm just recommending you wanna answer that, but you just wanna pay for someone to answer that maybe. So if like you had to pay only per...
being answered, fine. And maybe just have a dedicated, so for most of our clients, we have a dedicated new patient hotline. That's also tracked with call rails, so we can see where the marketing is working, where these calls are originating from. Was it captured? On some of these call services, there's recording and transcription. So if maybe you're getting them captured, but maybe someone's not booking, you can look at the notes and go, okay, every time someone mentioned cosmetic dentistry or dental implants, what was the scripting? So there's ways to figure out.
what's broken, like fixing the leaks, as you call them. So, you know, there's all these different things to do with tracking, but I would say, like, fixing the leaks is a really important thing also, Alec, right, like making sure your contact forms and your WordPress website are not broken. It's scary how many are for businesses and they don't know it. Making sure you're answering the phone, like I said, making sure you're checking your DMs on Instagram, like all these things, if they're not being captured.
will impact your CRO. So besides all the fun, cool things like eyelines and header images, just as importantly is like making sure you're getting the form submissions and responding to like quickly, right? And so there's all these different tools out there to help with these leaks and growth ideas. You know, other things like, I'm just trying to go down the list on that homepage, right Alec? Like another element that's important on a homepage is
Google 360 virtual tour, right? So somewhere on your website, you want tour our dental practice. So having a Google 360 virtual tour, in my opinion, is like probably one of the most important SEO moves of all time. And so for that, you would just hire a trusted local pro in your specific area to come out with their special camera and capture a 360 tour. And so, but that would be embedded and hosted on your WordPress website. And that's like a one and done deal. And so that's like,
kind of source locally. So all these things that you're doing for your marketing, whether it's video, SEO, AdWords, hopefully whoever you're using for your agency to manage your website, I would recommend having them figure out the rest of the staff, because there's way more synergy, and I think success and focus moving forward. If usually you have one agency or one marketing person.
helping you either at the office or externally. That's what we have found. It doesn't have to be that way, but it's ideal, especially for like a standalone location. It's better if like everyone's on the same page in terms of social media content, analytics, new patient numbers. So there's kind of this cohesive teamwork moving forward.
Alec Goldman (25:33.870)
Brad, 25 minutes in. Any last thoughts here?
Any last thoughts?
That's good. So Alan, so let me ask you this. In terms of your, let's just take outside of dentistry for a second. What is one of your favorite brands that you feel like is one of your favorite brands that you love either following on social media or you feel you're like spending a lot of money there or you like, you know, what is your favorite brand?
Alec Goldman (26:05.590)
You know, I've had the I had this question where it was asked, which is my favorite B2B brand. Um, but for B2C, at least in regards to their marketing and product, I definitely, and maybe I'm a sucker cause I just saw air, but Nike definitely, uh, you know, comes to mind.
How great was that movie? No, it's good. It's good, I can't believe you, I can't tell you how many times I don't hear that anymore. Nike, yeah, it's the weirdest thing. Like it's, yeah, it's weird.
Alec Goldman (26:26.814)
Boring. It was unbelievable.
Alec Goldman (26:34.738)
What? Nike? Yeah, well, they're at the best. They do the right job of inspiring the end goal. They're not making it about their product.
Oh, okay, so I love Nike, obviously. I grew up in Chi-Town. I grew up watching Jordan every night, eating little old Nottie's pizza, and incredible movie. And we don't want to spoiler alert this for anyone who hasn't seen the movie. So, but I don't think it's a spoiler alert. What was your favorite part of the movie? The favorite part of the movie, like in terms of like in the story maybe you didn't know about, or like, you know, what kind of sticks out?
Alec Goldman (27:03.115)
It's honest brother, it is.
Alec Goldman (27:13.846)
When Matt Damon goes off script and gives his little speech, and maybe the 10 to 15 seconds prior of just reading the room with Ben Affleck and the family sitting there, and just kind of watching that whole dilemma, be like, was this really the moment that Michael Jordan decided that he would change Nike's trajectory forever? Was it that specific speech?
Alec Goldman (27:40.694)
So that was probably my favorite moment. What about you?
So I got the goosebumps. That's a great movie. This is why it's such a good movie and you asked 100 people, we're gonna get 100 different answers. I really think so, for sure. So what I found most fascinating was, so everyone talks about the shot, the shot that MJ hit at North Carolina to win the championship. Everyone talks about the shot, how he caught it and hit it.
Alec Goldman (27:51.363)
When Damon's character saw what, the shot was a shot, he thought, how did he even have the chance to get the shot? How did Dean Smith, who never even would play a rookie in all the years, much less have Jordan on the floor for that moment to be Dean Smith's defining moment of his career?
Alec Goldman (29:04.362)
That is, his analysis was remarkable.
Yeah, so the whole thing was like, how did Jordan actually get in that position to be successful? And I forget the player who was on the court then, but there was a total stud player also. It wasn't James Worthy or someone else who they didn't even look at. It was so obvious by the way the play was developed. He was never getting the ball. The ball was totally designed to go to Jordan. So Matt Damon's character was like, if Dean Smith was with this guy every day at practice, his teammates were with him every day at practice, and
When Jordan arrived, there was like some other stud recruit that was there for like two years already. He transferred out and Jordan arrived because he was like, this is ridiculous. I'm never gonna play. And so Damon thought it was like literally playing with insider knowledge or information. Like he was so confident of that information. He bet his, Damon's character bet his career. He bet Nike on it. And he had to share that passion with
The rest is history, that insight, right? So I find that fascinating, right? Like the story of how magic happens, the story of what was the moment before, right? And so when we tie this in on marketing, of business and dental practice and success, like your team, like find inspiration on your own. What is that unique patient experience? What are you trying to capture? Who is that patient avatar?
and double down on that. Don't listen to anyone else. Don't listen to what people are doing. Don't care about your competitors. What is your vision that you want to create? Have full confidence and conviction in that. And as a leader at your practice, sell that to the rest of the team. And like, you know, to achieve another, like Jordan's story is so exponential and different in the world, but it was so inspiring for anyone in business or branding or marketing to just like believe in your intuition and know when you have a right idea.
to go with it, right? And so at your practice with what's gonna catapult you from X amount of revenues to the next level, the new patient profitability, whatever it is, one practice, 50 DSOs, you gotta think about that on your own and have a team around you to help implement it, but like come up with an idea or a solution that's out of the box and that you follow your gut with and believe in it and go for greatness.
Alec Goldman (31:29.882)
Nice. I guess the other part to add is the Jordan decision of turning down the other agencies and writing his own path and being unique and saying this is gonna be my path and not following people who'd done it similar before and saying I'm gonna, and trusting your instinct enough to say if I'm gonna stand out, this is gonna be the path even if no one before had done it.
Totally. And also the, I think the shoe designer who put together, who came up with, whoever came up with the name Air Jordan, but the designer who came up with the, Jordan in the Air, what's it called? Like the mark, the logo identity of like flying in the air. I mean, think about it. It's like one of the greatest, most iconic images in like the history of like humanity.
Right, forget about marketing. Like everyone sees this, there's Michael Jordan in the air. And so that just so another level in terms of marketing and branding and idea and like one intuitive idea that like one person had changed like the industry. And so there's so many great lessons from AIR from like believing in your intuition, finding an idea like that everyone knows about already but coming up with a different solution to it. So like everyone's big on like chat GPT and AI which is amazing right now, but like
maybe at your practice, how you leverage it differently that no one's even thinking about right now? Is it coming up with a Fun Friday web series that's so funny and hilarious? That alone is your marketing hack? And no one's even thinking. So at your practice, so everyone's watching the same thing, but I'm trying to do this on my own and I wanna encourage others to, but think about, just shift the lens a little bit, right? And I think that's where you find a lot of that blue ocean space of like.
kind of less noise, less competition, and you can really level up quickly if you figure out those things.
Alec Goldman (33:23.950)
That's awesome. Brad, thank you for joining us. Shifting the conversation from not just conversion, but how Nike and Air provide great marketing lessons for all of our listeners, which is totally true. It was awesome having you on, and we'll definitely do this again.